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Resilience Development in Action
Discover practical resilience strategies that transform lives. Join Steve Bisson, licensed mental health counselor, as he guides first responders, leaders, and trauma survivors through actionable insights for mental wellness and professional growth.
Each week, dive deep into real conversations about grief processing, trauma recovery, and leadership development. Whether you're a first responder facing daily challenges, a leader navigating high-pressure situations, or someone on their healing journey, this podcast delivers the tools and strategies you need to build lasting resilience.
With over 20 years of mental health counseling experience, Steve brings authentic, professional expertise to every episode, making complex mental health concepts accessible and applicable to real-world situations.
Featured topics include:
• Practical resilience building strategies
• First responder mental wellness
• Trauma recovery and healing
• Leadership development
• Grief processing
• Professional growth
• Mental health insights
• Help you on your healing journey
Each week, join our community towards better mental health and turn your challenges into opportunities for growth with Resilience Development in Action.
Resilience Development in Action
E.218 Behind the Scenes at the IAFF Center of Excellence with Hannah Elmore
In this powerful conversation, Hannah Elmore, Senior Clinical Outreach Coordinator for the IAFF Center of Excellence, reveals the critical role of culturally competent care in supporting firefighter mental health. Drawing from her extensive background in clinical social work and deep immersion in fire service culture, Hannah illuminates the often-overlooked nuances of how mental health challenges uniquely manifest in first responders.
The discussion takes us behind the curtain of the IAFF Center of Excellence, a specialized treatment facility created specifically for firefighters seeking help with behavioral health challenges. Unlike traditional hospital settings, this 15-acre facility offers various levels of care in an environment where firefighters can heal among peers who truly understand their experiences. Hannah paints a vivid picture of the Center's approach, from clinical programming to the nightly gatherings around the fire pit—a space intentionally kept free from clinical staff where some of the deepest healing occurs.
Perhaps most compelling is the honest examination of barriers that prevent firefighters from seeking help. Hannah addresses head-on the fears about confidentiality and career impact that keep many suffering in silence. "If you're sweeping things under the rug," she cautions, "eventually the rug is going to get a really big mountain that you're going to trip over." This metaphor perfectly captures the cumulative weight of unaddressed trauma and stress.
Steve and Hannah also discuss the frustrating reality of therapists who lack the necessary understanding of first responder culture. They share stories of firefighters who've had negative experiences with providers who were overwhelmed by their trauma narratives or misinterpreted symptoms due to cultural ignorance. Their passion for connecting first responders with appropriate, vetted resources shines through as they emphasize their collaborative approach to resource sharing.
Whether you're a firefighter struggling with your mental health, a peer support member looking to better assist your colleagues, or a clinician wanting to better serve the first responder community, this episode offers invaluable insights into creating pathways to healing. Ready to learn more about specialized behavioral health support for firefighters? Listen now and discover why cultural competency makes all the difference.
Part 2 will be released next week!
To learn even more about the IAFF Center of Excellence, go to www.iaffrecoverycenter.com
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Welcome to Resilience Development in Action, where strength meets strategy and courage to help you move forward. Each week, your host, steve Bisson, a therapist with over two decades of experience in the first responder community, brings you powerful conversations about resilience, growth and healing through trauma and grief. Through authentic interviews, expert discussions and real-world experiences, we dive deep into the heart of human resilience. We explore crucial topics like trauma recovery, grief processing, stress management and emotional well-being. This is Resilience Development in Action with Steve Bisson.
Speaker 2:Well, hi everyone. For those of you who are on YouTube, you are going to meet Bobblehead Steve If. For those of you who are not on YouTube, go check it out. But welcome to episode 218. If you haven't listened to episode 217, it was the second one with Ashley and Dustin Wright. I hope you enjoy the interview. It was really great. We did a two-part and we're going to do probably a two-part with this guest.
Speaker 2:Hannah Elmore is someone I consider a friend, someone I've known for about three years. We were connected from our former colleague. She took over for our colleague and she is the clinical outreach coordinator for the IAFF Center of Excellence. Hannah works with firefighters through connections to behavioral health resources, provides education and offers support. Hannah educates on behavioral health topics on fire service as well as first responder communities, to departments, peer teams as well as families and clinicians. She receives her master's degree in social work from Florida State University, go Seminoles, and is certified IAFF peer support. Great interview, I'm sure. Like I said, I've known her for a long time. She decided to come on, which was amazing. So I think it's going to go for two episodes because it's going to keep on talking about it, because I love it. I've had about a year and a half 18 months practice with it and I still enjoy it and it saves me time and it saves me energy.
Speaker 2:Freeai takes your note, makes a trans and what you're talking about a client just press record, and it does me energy. Freedai takes your note, makes a transcript of what you're talking with a client just press record, and it does either transcript, it does a subjective and an objective, with a letter if needed for your client and for whoever might need it. So for $99 a month, it saves me so much time that it's worthwhile. And if you do it for a whole year, guess what? You get 10% off. More importantly, this is what you got to remember because you are my audience that listens to Resilience Development in Action. If you do listen to this and you want to use freeai, put in the code Steve50 in the promo code area, steve50, and you will get $50 off in addition to everything we just talked about. Get freed from writing your notes, get freed from even writing your transcripts. Use that to your advantage. Freeai a great service. Go to get freeai and you will get one of the best services that will save you time and money and I highly encourage you to do so money, and I highly encourage you to do so.
Speaker 2:Well, hi everyone and welcome to episode 218. I have what I consider a friend from very. We're very far apart geographically yet I think we speak at least once a month, if a little more than that, actually about different things. She's one of the best people I've met in the treatment for first for firefighters particularly, and who has been, you know, calling me about certain things. We had a. I was on vacation. She gave me a nice little call about something. We'll keep that to ourselves, but it was like that's how our relationship is, I think. Sometimes she's not working and she answers the phone call and those are solid people you want in your life. Hannah Elmore, welcome to Resilience Development in Action.
Speaker 3:Thank you, steve. I'm so excited to be here and always enjoy my time with you so greatly, and looking forward to this conversation today.
Speaker 2:You know right, pre-interview everyone knows I do a pre-interview. I was like geez, we're going on on 15 minutes. I probably should press record at some point. We're talking about life. We're talking about uh, no, both the center of excellence, which I can't wait for you guys to hear more. If you don't know what it is, you need to hear more, but more of the human being, which I truly appreciate you as a human being. Need to hear more, but more of the human being which I truly appreciate you as a human being, hannah. But obviously people might not know who you are I do, but how about you tell everyone here listening to a little bit?
Speaker 3:more about yourself. Thank you, Steve, and same to you with how much I appreciate the friendship that we've built and just the professional relationship that we have and the conversations that we have. That really better me as a person too, up to as recent as less than 15 minutes ago, when you were giving me some incredible parenting advice and guidance as a new mom myself, for those that don't know. So thank you, Steve, and hello everyone. I'm excited to be here today. My name is Hannah Elmore. I'm the Senior Clinical Outreach Coordinator for the IFF Center of Excellence, which is the International Association of Firefighters Center of Excellence for Behavioral Health Treatment and Recovery, which I know we'll talk a little bit more about in a bit. Just to make sure that all of you all are aware of that resource for those that are in the fire service, my role on this team is to operate to basically connect first responders with resources as soon as possible. If there is a need that comes up or even a question about what's out there and what is a resource that is a good fit for what they're looking for, I want to partner with you and be able to help you find that resource as soon as possible.
Speaker 3:My background is clinical, so I do have a background in clinical social work. I have my MSW in social work from Florida State University and, if you know me, I am a huge Florida State Seminoles fan and looking very forward to football season starting in just a couple of weeks. I do reside in the state of Florida. I have most of my life and my clinical training is basically rooted in health care. I did receive a lot of my clinical training in different health care settings, including the James A Haley Veterans Hospital in Tampa, as well as Johns Hopkins All Children's Hospital in St Petersburg and then some various nonprofit agencies as well. I do not operate in a direct practice role in this capacity. I am operating in more of a resource connection and an education-based practice to make sure to not only connect individuals with resources but provide some of those proactive tools to wellness and really shining a light on the topic of behavioral health. So it can be something that is tangible, approachable and something that individuals can kind of add to their tool belt each and every day.
Speaker 3:Now, in my intro I do also want to touch on the fact that working every day with fire service members and not coming from a fire service background, that is a huge responsibility on me to educate myself and really armor myself with understanding how to work work with fire service members better understand the culture, better understand the structure of their career, better understand just how they interact with each other and what are some of those best practices to treatment. So I have gone through more of those formal trainings. I am certified in IFF peer support. I'm certified in some various clinician trainings in working with firefighters and I've spent a ton of time at station houses, around the kitchen table, on ride-alongs and fire ops experiences, really just doing what I can to learn and grow each and every day. So that's a little snapshot of me.
Speaker 3:On a personal level, I became a mom last year and I have a 14-month-old daughter and truly the center of my husband and I's world and parenthood has certainly changed me for the absolute better and Steve and I have talked about that many of the times, how wonderful it is to become a mom. So that's a little personal touch about me as well.
Speaker 2:And a wonderful mom at that, because the curiosity and the wanting to remember the right things is so important for parenthood. But I'm sure that people didn't join necessarily to hear about our parenting skills. I do have a background. You talk about clinical background. Most people don't know, but my background is children and family services.
Speaker 3:Oh, I don't know. I don't even know if I knew that Steve.
Speaker 2:I think that most people, even my colleagues in this building, they're like really, I never see children or family and I'm like, yeah, it's a long story, but the bottom line is I so love working with kids. Unfortunately, I worked in a service where parents weren't always the best, so it really discouraged me to work with children. So I decided to do something easier. I'm going to work with first responders, because that's the easy part.
Speaker 3:Easier, certainly different, but having that background, really it's clear in the way that you are so validating, in the way that you talk to people and really the way that you connect with people. So thank you for sharing that. I wasn't aware of that.
Speaker 2:Well, I figured you know, so you're sharing a little bit. I'll share about me. This is, I think, the first time it's been said on this podcast.
Speaker 3:Love it Making history.
Speaker 2:You know you'll learn well. You know my CBT background, you know all that background. But one of the things that I love about I love hearing is that I know that you've listened to this podcast before, but what made you decide? Like gee willikers, I really want to talk on Steve's podcast because I don't know many people who are like certainly not my shiny personality that wins, but wanted to know why you want to join the podcast.
Speaker 3:I feel like this podcast is such a wonderful opportunity to connect with first responders and in their families all over and just have comfortable, proactive conversations about behavioral health and kind of make it an easier to approach type of conversation, not too serious, not too intimidating, but something that can be an easy listen and really just help to normalize and validate the experiences of others.
Speaker 3:And I've been on this team now working with IFF members for three years and the daily learning that I have gone through just to learn from the experiences of others and to learn from peer support teams and learn from those that are in leadership when they kind of step in to help the behavioral health of their members, and seeing the impact of reaching out and asking for help has been so amazing to witness. And so any opportunity that I can, you know, share anything about contributing to the conversation about proactive steps to wellness, I'm all in. So I thought this could be a really cool opportunity and, steve, you and I go back and forth so often. I figured why not televise it, why not publicize it and then and let others be witness to our conversations as well? So that was something I thought could be beneficial to.
Speaker 2:I think it's also good to show that you know there is is for me. I will tell you the other reason besides I, you know I obviously love you, but I also think that what happened is that I feel like people don't understand that when you leave a place like the center of excellence, there is a continuum of care that exists, and then that you know clinicians and people who work at the center of excellence, whether they're not directly or not, I do know Hannah. So when you say John Doe is looking for someone, I could look to Hannah and say no openings or yes, send them in, and she follows through and say hey, by the way, I want to make sure that John Doe or Jane Doe and we're not gender bias here is showing up. There is a continuous of care, and so I think that that's one of the things that is misunderstood about these centers.
Speaker 2:Right, because I mean, you know you talked about your clinical background, but I think that people don't understand that maybe while it is inpatient, it sometimes feels like outpatient, and then there's a continuing. It's not like all right, you're gone, see you later and sorry for putting anyone down, but regular hospitals tend to be that way, but you're not like that. So you know, knowing a little more about your clinical background, is that what brought you to kind of that thought process in regards to we need to follow up with people and we got to find what again, this is something I feel like I plug every single time on my podcast Culturally competent first responder therapist, because I think that's key. If you're not culturally competent, there's no point to this.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, and unfortunately, one of the biggest barriers that I hear from individuals that have not maybe received the help that they've reached out to get is because they're seeing providers or they're going to programs that are not culturally competent. They do not have the experience to work with first responders and their intentions may be in the best place, but if they're missing that key understanding of not only the cultural aspects of first responder professions but also the treatment approaches that are proven to be effective, modalities that are beneficial to utilize in a clinical setting, and different presentations of symptoms amongst first responders compared to civilians I'll speak to depression, for example. I mean we see typical, you know, standard, if you will presentations of depression in a civilian could look very different than they might look in a first responder that is working multiple jobs and taking on overtime and really good at masking and appearing very productive, whereas that's not really the hallmark signs of depression, which is more so, you know sad and depressed mood and changing your you know everyday activities that are enjoyable and some other symptoms that if somebody is not culturally competent perhaps they might miss. And so you know, I've unfortunately heard very negative experiences of first responders that have accessed care with providers that don't have that experience and unfortunately, sometimes those providers have an adverse reaction to stories that they share and then that places the first responder back in that responder mode of now I have to take care of my therapist and further isolates them into their struggles of. I can't even tell my therapist about this, I can't tell anyone about this, so I'm just going to keep it to myself and continue to struggle in silence.
Speaker 3:And so really having the opportunity to be connected to a provider that gets it whether they personally come from the first responder profession, their family does or they have done a ton of that work and education themselves to understand the profession is crucial to make sure that somebody can feel they're in a safe place, they are with someone that understands. They don't have to spend the entire session explaining what shift work is and what their chain of command looks like and their day-to-day. They can skip all that part and they can really just dive into it with somebody that truly understands, and there's an incredible impact in being able to do that.
Speaker 2:I think the symptomology you hit the nail on the head. Dissociation is seen as dissociation identity disorder. That's what the clinical people know and there's nothing wrong with that and I respect that they feel that way. But if you dissociate in the sense that you're going to the job and you're just going call to call and you're dissociating from calls, that's your first sign of either ptsd or depression for a first responder. So you don't go oh, he's did.
Speaker 2:Sorry for all the clinical jargon, but you got to be able to pick up on those little things. Or there's, there's an avoidance. People like, oh, an avoidance they don't want to talk about. Or it's trauma, no, it's anxiety, because they're afraid of where it's going to fucking go. And and people are like, well, that's different. I'm like, yeah, dsm doesn't know everything and people present differently. And so I think my, our folks definitely show up. And if I hear one more story of a first responder who come in who told me like the therapist was crying or was unable to take my story, I feel like I get so angry. And most of them again, all therapists out there listening to me if you're culturally competent, great, I'm so happy. If you're not, don't pretend you are Because you're deserving the first responders. You didn't come into this profession to make money. You came to this profession to help people and if you're lying, you're deserving the first responders. You didn't come into this profession to make money. You came to this profession to help people and if you're lying, you're deserving people.
Speaker 3:So that's my little PSA for the day and I will add on to that. I really love that you said that, because we do a couple of trainings for clinicians and I lead one of our ongoing trainings that we have quarterly. And one of the things that I share is if this is not for you, that's okay. And one of the things that I share is if this is not for you, that's okay. If you do not want to work with first responders, if you're not comfortable with vulgar language, if you're not comfortable with cynicism, if you're not comfortable with really graphic details of calls, please kind of look internally and know that's not something you're comfortable with and that is perfectly okay because it's not for everybody. Just like being a child specialty, having a subspecialty of working with children or working with couples or working with a certain type of disorder, may not be for everyone there's nothing wrong with that. But it's really important to know, kind of, what you are advertising so that you are bringing in the clientele that makes the most sense for that therapeutic relationship.
Speaker 2:I think the other part too, that I would say that is very different with my first responders. They'll make fun of me, and not in a bad way, right, and people get upset about that in the other world, like they. There's again I've mentioned this on a podcast, so there's a French maid joke that's been made in my group almost a year ago that continues to like they're waiting for me to show up in a French maid joke that's been made in my group almost a year ago that continues to like they're waiting for me to show up in a French maid outfit one day. I'll do it, but I'll, definitely I'll put you on video.
Speaker 2:Just I'll put you, uh, off camera. They won't know you're there and that's okay. They already. You already intended our group. So you, you know how it is. But but what I think? Therapists who don't understand a cultural competency. The other part, too, is if they're picking on you, they love you. If they're not talking to you or they're just telling you the facts, you are fucked.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they don't trust you.
Speaker 2:So I think that that's the other part too. You were mentioning about how different they are. They'll make a comment like that but if I just took it for face value, what? Why can't they let go of that comment? Then they're going to be like, okay, this guy can't take my trauma, I can't even take a joke. And that's again a very big, distinguishing experience with first responders.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, and they deserve to have a safe place that they can completely put their walls down and completely process whatever it is that they need to, whether it's related to the job or not, and know that there's nothing that is within them that is too broken to receive support and help for or too much to share with somebody.
Speaker 3:And so, Steve, you and I have worked very closely on connecting a ton of first responders to you for outpatient support, and that's something that, for anyone listening here, you know, whether you're in the state of Massachusetts or anywhere else in the country. If you are looking for a connection to one of these vetted providers that has the cultural competency to work with first responders and to really understand the job, feel free to reach out to me. Reach out to Steve if you're local to his area. Understand the job. Feel free to reach out to me. Reach out to Steve If you're local to his area. We certainly will get you connected and want to be sure that you have access to a safe place, a safe person that you can talk to, and that you can really begin to work through some of these challenges, because it is truly so important and I think that that's the other part, too is sometimes I work with people.
Speaker 2:I actually gave your phone number to someone who is in North Carolina, a firefighter, and I don't know if they reach out or not. That's not important for the podcast, but the important thing is we need to get those resources out and I want competent people, and I think that that's what you're talking about, and I think it makes so much more sense. I'm the world doesn't revolve around massachusetts, as so or so I heard. It doesn't. No, that's what I heard, but the point is, is that's? That's why, like one of the things that has changed, maybe you can speak to that too.
Speaker 2:I remember a time, not too long ago in fact, I heard it this year 2025 someone said to me oh, you share your resources to everyone and like, why would I keep that to myself? Like it's going to help me to hold on to this crap, but living in these silos and living in this isolation will never help a first responder, firefighter, police, correctional staff it doesn't really matter to me because, oh, I know all the resources, but I'm only going to tell two people. I don't understand that.
Speaker 3:Totally agree. And what's the point of the resources if they're not being utilized? And why would it behoove us to not share it with others and not make sure that others have access to those resources? And so I know you and I have done a ton of resource sharing and that's something that we really want to be sure that it gets out there that individuals are aware of what is available to them and have connection to those clinicians that have really done the work and have really paved the way in their you know respective states to be those point of contacts for those individuals and so happy to share anything in anyone's area that would be beneficial to them, whether it's with us or not.
Speaker 3:At the Center of Excellence, like, we really want to be sure that individuals have options and know that there's various different reasons that one may reach out, and we just want to be sure that they get connected to whatever they're comfortable with at the quickest possible rate that we can. And so that's a big aspect of my role is in that resource connection and that education about kind of what's out there and what can we do to you know, not only say, hey, here are these providers, but I will kind of take it a step further and not only say here are the providers in your area, but I'll call them and make sure that they're accepting new clients, that the insurance makes sense, that they match clinically for kind of what they're looking for and that it sounds like a good fit for their practice, and take as much of that preliminary work as I can to make sure that it removes any possible barrier to making that appointment or accessing that facility or whatever that may be.
Speaker 2:I think that that's the other part, too, that I truly love about you and love about the IAFF center. If I remember, it was Molly that was before you. Yes, remember, I would call Molly and she goes oh yeah, here's 12 people you can refer to, and it shocked me that someone was giving away these resources, and I want to give the same tribute to you that you do the same thing. In fact, I know that, for those of you who caught episode 214, if I remember correctly, that behind the badge and beyond, that's a group that we have, but we have about 27 or so vetted people that we know that work with first responders, and Hannah's like do you know any resources? I'm like here's the link to the I don't know Excel spreadsheet, whatever it is.
Speaker 2:And you were like, oh, this is so helpful, I don't care how they get the service. And you were like, oh, this is so helpful, I don't care how they get the service, whether it's Aaron and Richard or Jen or Lisa or Alexa I'm just naming the people that are on the podcast or John Doe or Jane Doe, what do I care, as long as they get the services, I don't care. And that's really what the IFF and the Center of Excellence has really helped me get better at sharing all these resources, and I've certainly called other places that I will not mention here who have been like. Who are you? I'm looking for support for my client. Can you freaking help me?
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, I agree wholeheartedly, and it's just important to connect individuals with those providers that are out there doing the good work, and you know we want to get that done and I know that you share that as well, steve and I know we've worked collaboratively on that and I really appreciate that.
Speaker 2:And I think that we're looking at a long collaboration, me and you. And hopefully one day we'll go to the same conference. I guess I got to look for conferences in Florida one day.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 2:Well, when I'm in Massachusetts, I need to stop on by.
Speaker 2:My trips are just shorter these days with the baby at home. Now I know that's why I'm saying maybe I got to go to Florida in the next couple of years, then, as my kids are grown yours are a little younger, your child's a little younger so maybe we'll swap at some point locations. But the more important part, too, is what I find with like firefighters, like my first experience with firefighters when I worked in a I didn't work too long but I did work in a firehouse. They would sit around the table and talk, but sometimes that's not enough and that's not against anyone in the fire service, but they don't know how to reach out. They're like oh well, you know, I talked to the LT, I talked to the captain, I talked to whatever, but they need more than that, but they need more than that. So you know, one of the questions I always wonder is what type of advice would you give a firefighter that probably needs to reach out in some way?
Speaker 3:shape or form Totally.
Speaker 3:And I do want to speak to the power of peer support because, you know, sitting around the kitchen table and having that peer support is such a cornerstone that is so pivotal for fire service members to have that built-in support, that shared understanding, that brotherhood, that sisterhood that already exists so beautifully in the fire service and within the IFF, and then for those that take a step further and become certified in peer support. You all are making an incredible impact in the lives of others and making it okay to reach out and ask for help. But, as Steve said, you know there are circumstances where clinical services are needed, a higher level of care is needed. You know someone maybe would benefit from something that is beyond peer support and it can be really difficult to know kind of what those next steps are and how to navigate that. And I think it really does, you know, specifically depend on the circumstance in terms of what exactly is going on. If it's an emergent situation, perhaps connecting with a, with a crisis line or, you know, getting somebody to safety as soon as possible. If it isn't, you know, knowing what your resources are. You know myself, our IFF Center of Excellence team nationwide we are here to be able to kind of navigate what those next steps look like.
Speaker 3:As a confidential resource, you know, I always say if somebody calls me or a peer calls me, no one ever has to know that phone call ever happened. And I think that's really important because a lot of times there's that hesitation Even if I make the call, who's going to find out that we're even connected, you know, if they call into me or into our admissions team, even just for a recommendation for a therapist, nobody that you know. They don't want anybody to find out. And that's one of the first conversations that we have is this is completely confidential, this is exclusively for you guys to know. This is safe, this is confidential and this is something that is really just in place to be able to provide that support. So I would say, for those that are in peer support and are kind of on the forefront of initiating these conversations, just having those resources available and knowing what they are, having contact information for us, for Steve, if you're in Massachusetts, for the Center of Excellence, and knowing who those people are to kind of go through the next steps, there's different tools that can be used to kind of help facilitate that conversation too. The stress continuum model can be a really cool check-in tool to kind of put around the kitchen table and kind of use it as a touch point of hey, after that call, where are we, when are you right now? Where do you want to be? What are the resources or the coping skills or the self-care that can bring you back to a more stabilized or a more comfortable level? And then kind of depending on where somebody is, just knowing it is okay to reach out and ask for help. It is a safe, confidential resource for you.
Speaker 3:And I would say one of the biggest hesitations outside of the confidentiality concern that I hear is how will this impact my career If I reach out and ask for help? Well, certainly no one's going to trust me, no one's going to follow my leadership, no one is going to want me on the job anymore. But we see most commonly it is actually the opposite. When individuals reach out and ask for help, they come home more whole. They are able to work through what they're struggling with. That, if they don't, perhaps will lead to more maladaptive coping strategies like substance use to numb out some traumatic thoughts and feelings or to try to sleep. Anger and marital issues that are kind of spewing out from unresolved processing of feelings will be more resolved for healthier homes and healthier, more present home lives if we undergo some treatment or some processing.
Speaker 3:A lot of times individuals, when they are really struggling, they are showing up late to work, they're taking more sick time, Maybe they're showing up hungover or disheveled or not how they used to be, and so, although of course, that fear of you know how will this impact my job?
Speaker 3:We certainly validate that and we hear you.
Speaker 3:But we definitely see when individuals do seek out help, they come home to much longer, healthier, happier careers, bodies, home lives and it's something that can be really beneficial for the long run.
Speaker 3:I always say, if you're sweeping things under the rug, eventually the rug is going to get a really big mountain that you're going to trip over or adding rocks into the backpack. If I keep adding rocks in the backpack, eventually the backpack is going to be too heavy to keep on holding. And so there is relief out there, there is support out there, and we're ready to get you connected to that as soon as we can. But it does take making that call or a peer supporting you along that process, perhaps putting their hand on your shoulder and making the call for you while you're with them and kind of being that supportive person along the way. So there's no wrong way to get connected with our team or to a resource, but it does take, you know, making that step and taking that call. And again, sometimes it can be the peer's role to really make sure that that's facilitated too.
Speaker 2:I appreciate you saying that about the peer support. I didn't want to seem derogatory at all about that.
Speaker 3:I really am a fan, oh I didn't think you were and I don't want it to come off like I was trying to negate that. No, no, no.
Speaker 2:I didn't feel. But I just wanted to reiterate that I'm a big fan of peer support scissor, scissor, depending on what week. And while you were talking, there's a few things that you talked about. The rug I smile. So if you want to go to youtube, uh, it's because we've exchanged on that idea so many times, so that's why it made me smile. I've heard that one before. The other part too is, I you know, a little quick idea for us to maybe work on and collaborate for the iff iff, I'm more than happy to help is maybe creating what they call in re-entry the sequential intercept model. But I think the point of entry for first responders or firefighters would be important, because having a warm line is different than the peer support. The peer support's different than a scissor.
Speaker 2:A wellness visit thank you for mentioning those Big fan of wellness visits. But then you know there's inpatient, there's outpatient group, there's partial. But being able to kind of explain all these things for first responders, particularly firefighters in this case, might be helpful, because I think it's so intimidating I mean, you can speak to that too, but I was writing down can that be intimidating for firefighters? Because once you start talking about inpatient or even partial hospital, which we know what that means, but when you don't know what that means, oh so they're going to just hold the door. For me, what does partial hospital mean Totally? I mean, you can speak a little bit of that fear you talked about it over the phone and talking to peers but there's also not knowing this model Totally.
Speaker 3:And I agree with you completely and that's why I think having that transparency and having that person to be able to walk an individual through this and kind of look at all those different options of levels of care as you mentioned, there's inpatient, partial hospitalization, intensive, outpatient, outpatient All of that can sound super, super clinical and very intimidating, and so to be able to kind of walk through what exactly that means and I'll speak to the IFF Center of Excellence Programming in particular the IFF created this facility to make it something that is comfortable for fire service members.
Speaker 3:You mentioned earlier about a hospital system and you know oftentimes four-wall hospital, very medical facilities and I'm not saying you said this, I'll speak to this are oftentimes not the best fit for fire service members for many reasons. But let's just be honest, you guys are oftentimes running patients to these facilities. You work professionally alongside these doctors and nurses and other providers at these hospitals. It would be very intimidating and not very private to be able to receive care alongside them, not to mention just the structure of an involuntary hospital psychiatric unit in general is very different from what the IFF Center of Excellence has created and facilitated to be something that is approachable and comfortable for fire service members.
Speaker 3:So, although those levels of care inpatient, partial hospitalization, iop, as you had mentioned are offered at the Center of Excellence, I do want to emphasize that it is not a hospital program. That's just what the levels of care are called and that just determines how many hours per day and how many days per week that somebody is in programming and it just kind of depends on how often they're seeing their medical provider, how often they're in group, how often they have more free time, if you will, to do the other wellness and recreational activities. And it helps to prepare somebody to discharge at the lower level of care and go back home and then resume outpatient on an ongoing basis. And so at the IFF Center of Excellence all of those levels of care are offered, but it is on a very different setting than a hospital. It is on 15 acres, it is. There's a lot of autonomy to roam around, go on nature trails and really engage in a ton of mind, body, spirit type of activities with a huge emphasis on wellness physical wellness, spiritual wellness, a ton of peer camaraderie through peer support, peer led groups.
Speaker 3:I talked to an alumni the other day and they always mentioned that the fire pit which was a gathering almost every night after clinical programming, which some may say a fire pit and a treatment program. Well, these are firefighters, so you know it is certainly different than most other facilities, but that is a space that no clinicians or staff are allowed out there. It is only for the fire service members and I hear from a ton of alumni that is where most of their healing took place was, of course, the clinical programming of their day was very intense and, you know, push them through towards healing and recovery. But having that time to just share experiences with one another, lean on the shared experiences of other first responders, that validation from everyone really having that wall to just completely come down, unique circumstance of a fire pit at a treatment facility really speaks to how different the IFF Center of Excellence is from any other treatment facility and what has been so beneficial for so many individuals.
Speaker 3:And so I really thank you for bringing up kind of that intimidation of what those levels of care sound like and there's so many choices and how do I know what to do and how to navigate this. So I will say, you know our team is happy to kind of walk through and explain in as much detail as you need, kind of what all that means prior to making the decision of how you want to move forward. And then I will also say we focus very heavily on proactive education and on our. We have a webinar series where we host clinical trainings twice a month, some of which really go into navigating the behavioral healthcare system and what do all these acronyms mean and what do these levels of care mean and what does my insurance cover? And more of those for those that are looking for maybe more of a hands-off, you know, private if you will, information seeking if they don't want to call us, but we are here to help walk you through that as well.
Speaker 2:Well, I told you episode 218 wouldn't cover it, so we got to go to 219. So I hope you join us for the next episode.
Speaker 1:Please like, subscribe and follow this podcast on your favorite platform. A glowing review is always helpful and, as a reminder, this podcast is for informational, educational and entertainment purposes only. If you're struggling with a mental health or substance abuse issue, please reach out to a professional counselor for consultation. If you are in a mental health crisis, call 988 for assistance. This number is available in the United States and Canada.
