Resilience Development in Action: First Responder Mental Health

E.231 Breaking The Stigma Around Addiction (Part 2 of 2)

• Steve Bisson, Lisa Trusas • Season 12 • Episode 231

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As we continue the conversation with Lisa, Trusas. Stigma is a quiet siren—it keeps people from asking for help, and it teaches the rest of us to look away. We open up about what addiction really looks like inside emergency services and at home, from dispatch centers and correctional facilities to ERs and patrol rooms. We talk about growing up in households where chaos felt normal, why “functioning alcoholic” gets a pass while heroin use gets a scarlet letter, and how the words we choose either build bridges or burn them.

You’ll hear how one honest admission inside a department transformed the room: jokes faded, questions surfaced, and colleagues started asking how to help their loved ones. We unpack the trap of “it’s legal, so it’s fine,” whether it’s alcohol, vaping, benzos, or 3 a.m. sports betting. We also dig into the system-level barriers—insurance limits, AMA discharges, closed youth detox beds—that make recovery harder than it needs to be. And we highlight practical steps anyone can take: use person-first language, speak privately when you’re worried, leverage peer-to-peer centers, and know the basics of getting someone into detox or a civil commitment when it’s the safest option.

Addiction doesn’t care about uniforms or titles. It shows up as compulsion, secrecy, and a deep fear of being seen. Recovery shows up as patience, multiple tries, and small moments of courage—the text that arrives months later, the hand held at the right time, the story that makes someone feel less alone. If you’re ready to trade labels for listening and shame for support, this conversation offers tools, perspective, and hope. Subscribe, share this with someone who needs it, and leave a review to help more people find real help without the noise.

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SPEAKER_01:

Welcome to Resilience Development and Action with Steve Beast Home. This is the podcast dedicated to first responder mental health, helping police, higher, EMS, discounters, and paramedics create better growth environments for themselves and their teams. Let's get started.

SPEAKER_00:

You know you've heard me talk about this before. Get free.ai. Great for your note-taking, good for your transcript, good for your goals, good for everything that you do on a HIPAA-compliant nature. And if you use code C50 at checkout, you will get$50 off your first month. And also if you get a whole year, you will also get 10% off the whole year. But getfree.ai has freed me to do more things with my life, including work on other passions. So get free to do your notes, get freed from doing your goals. Getfree.ai with code Steve50 to get$50 off your first month. Well, hi, and welcome to this bonus episode. We'll figure out the number by one point. With um resilience development in action, but more importantly, with someone I truly uh love, adore, and love talking to is Lisa Trousis. Um Lisa, you know, we talked about this patch, and I I will tell the audience and I will say the same thing to you. I wanted people to hear the real thing about this patch.

SPEAKER_02:

I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00:

And I will never ever forget to mention my dispatch people. And I told you before any interview that I think we got to figure out a way to not call it first responders, but maybe emergency responders. Because I think of my dispatch sometimes not being included. I think about my ER nurses and doctors, and I work with those too. And that's not first line, but it's first line and a half, maybe.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

And let's not forget people who do first responder hospital and law enforcement all at the same time, the correctional staff.

SPEAKER_03:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

You know, we're right in Milford here. There's the correctional union on the other side. Shout out to them. I've worked with DOC, I've worked with many counties, but they're emergency people, because I've been there when there's an emergency, it's not like they're like, well, let's call the ambulance. No, they're the ambulance. Um, transport afterwards, I get that. But um the bottom line is that I think that that's the best encompassing word about emergency responders. Um but getting off that soapbox for a little more, the other passion that me and you share is substance use. Not that we indulge too much in it.

unknown:

Kidding, kidding.

SPEAKER_00:

Um but the bottom line is that, you know, I grew up with a family with substance use. I have my first job out of my master's was a substance abuse coordinator, and that's like 2003. And before that, I was working with people who are dually diagnosed in the community. And if you think that substance use doesn't affect your life, you're full of shit. And I need to say that like that, and I know it's gonna be bleeped out, I don't care, because it's the truth. We all deal with it. Whether you turn your blind eye to that, that's another story. But I know that that's a passion that you have, that's a passion I have. Um we can tie it a little bit to the first responder world because it's definitely present there. Um but I'd like to hear more about your personal story in regards to that stuff.

SPEAKER_02:

So my father, brother, and soon-to-be ex-husband are all in recovery currently. Um, but they were all hemorrhagomadics. And growing up with my father as an alcoholic in addict, I thought it was normal. I thought the partying was normal. I thought the way of life was normal. Um I'm not too sure when I officially found out he was an addict, my father. Um, I think it was after my husband at the time came clean to me and said he was an addict. And I think that's when I found out my father was and my brother. And this was 20 years after, you know, I was in my 20s. Every emotion possible. And I didn't know how to handle it. I was clueless.

SPEAKER_00:

If you were my client and said, of course you didn't know what to how to handle it because this was normal.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

You know, again, to tie it a little bit to the first responder world, how many of guys you know and gals, not trying to be discriminatory here, um, who have not the same but similar backgrounds?

SPEAKER_02:

And they thought it was normal?

SPEAKER_00:

Like, I it's fascinating to me what people thought were normal. And I think that that's what happens with substance use. Of course, my dad offered me cocaine at 14. That's what we had in the house. Of course, it's okay for dad to be passed out all the time. That's what happens in my house. And I remember a particular woman I worked with, her father was in the was a law enforcement person. And for it took me to tell her, it's not normal for strange men to be in your room when you were a teenager. But I thought that was normal. No, it's not. So you accept because of substance use, because of the stuff that goes on, your normal is the normal that most people don't quite comprehend. Oh no, I gotta go wake up my dad because I know he's gonna be passed out when I get home. What?

SPEAKER_02:

Right. I think too, what which uh I think the stigmatism between alcohol and drugs, that stigmatism is completely separate too.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

I think more and more nowadays it's normal to be a functioning alcoholic. But God forbid you're a drug addict, you're addicted to heroin, fentanyl, cocaine, benzos, you're a horrible human being. Well, what about the alcoholics? They have it's an addiction.

SPEAKER_00:

I think that the addiction part is so difficult, particularly for first responders. And again, I think that the culture with this generation that's coming out, for better or for worse, in different ways, one of the things they've really changed is uh I think I was talking to someone here today about how the Gen Z population is a little more conscious about their drinking and their habits with that. Unfortunately, they can pop pills. And Adderall and benzos and um particularly the other one that people don't like to talk about is vaping, is all normalized. Because, oh, it's anxiety med. Of course you can take 17 clonopins in a day. Well, benzodiazepine and alcohol is the only two that you can die from withdrawals. And yes, people will argue the other ones are not great. I didn't say they were great, I said that you can't die from it. Um that happens in our departments, happens in our own lives.

SPEAKER_03:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

And then we replicate, and then this is the point I want to make. You hide something in your family because who wants the alcoholic father, aunt, drug addict, uncle, cousin, sister, brother? So you hide that. So you get to a police department, you get a fire department, they have the same problems. What's your instincts? Well, we hid it in my family. How do we change that?

SPEAKER_02:

So I actually, obviously, for years I hid it. I had to listen to police officers and firefighters and other first responders, including myself, you know, use the slang words, derogatory, you know, the junkies, the this, the that. And finally, after several years, I got the courage to tell the people I work with that my father, brother, and soon-to-be ex-husband were heroin addicts. Because I was hoping to shed a little light, hoping to show them that their family don't didn't choose this way of life. And we're still supportive, as supportive as we can be. And it's hard to be on the other side of it listening to these horrible things. So once I was finally comfortable, I was I finally admitted it, you know, here and there to some of the people I worked with, because they're my family. I've been there for 20 years, I I'm at least there 40 hours a week, if not more. They're my family. And I slowly told people, and a lot of people are shocked. And then I have noticed over time they have become, I guess, more or less stigmatized against it, and they will come to me and ask questions. Um, I have had several people come to me and ask questions in regards to their significant others. Um, but the rest of the department doesn't know. So I'm glad I said something to maybe spark that conversation, to maybe open somebody else's eyes, or to let somebody know that like I've been through it. I didn't have anybody to go through it then. It was awful. I didn't have anybody to talk to, you can talk to me.

SPEAKER_00:

And I applaud you doing that. Um sign note um there's a few people I work with who go to their departments, and I'm no longer my therapist says, it's Steve said. And even though that sounds very trivial for some people, the fact that they talk about it openly and people know by me by name is how much we've grown in this field. Does it happen often? I'm not, I don't know. I have no clue, but there's three people in particular that go around like, you know what Steve said to me about that? And I love that. And we talk about substance abuse. I think mental health has been getting more accepting. Substance abuse has always been accepted as long as it's alcohol. Right?

SPEAKER_03:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

Because if not, they're junkies, they're uh pill addicts, they're I can think about other things that I want to keep from uh being bleeped out here. We still stigmatize more, in my opinion, what we would consider harder drug addiction, and I put that in quotation, and you bring the light to that. But I think that what we need to do is the overall general population is needs to understand. I don't mind if someone puts I person died unexpectedly, but please be honest about what's happening in real life because you're only perpetuating the stigma of substance use. I think what's the number? I think it's 40 million Americans uh will be addicted at some point. I can't remember the exact numbers, like like 12.5% of the population. And then lifetime, we're looking at about 80% of Americans.

SPEAKER_02:

I believe it.

SPEAKER_00:

And that includes behavioral addictions, you know, porn, gambling, stuff like that. And don't start me on porn and gambling in the police and fireworld.

SPEAKER_02:

Addiction comes in all shapes and sizes, all forms. It can be anything.

SPEAKER_00:

Or power.

SPEAKER_02:

And it's the same thing as a heroin addict, a cocaine addict, an alcoholic. Your addiction to porn or to video games or food or gambling is all the same addiction.

SPEAKER_00:

I might have ch um shared this on the podcast if I haven't, but one of my mo we we legalized gambling a few years ago on sports. But there was one of my guys who came in and said, I was up all night, came in early. He had worked a second shift, stayed up all night because he had to watch the ping pong in North Korea or South Korea, whatever the hell it was, because he had money on it.

SPEAKER_03:

Wow.

SPEAKER_00:

And I'm like, don't you think that's an addiction? No, it's legal. Like, alcohol's legal.

SPEAKER_02:

Alcohol's been legal for a long time.

SPEAKER_00:

Right. And I think that that's where it becomes a uh appropriate vice because it's legal. So not only do we have stigma, we have this legality crap.

SPEAKER_03:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

You know, oh, marijuana is legal, so do you want me to be high while I'm doing this interview or when I'm working? Because that's legal. Well, no, that's stupid. Oh, that's stupid, but you're betting on Korean ping pong in at three o'clock in the morning. Because that's the only thing you can bet on. Which one's most addicted?

SPEAKER_03:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

So how do we bring that up to people? Because that's the other part, too. And I think you talk about the stigma. Um, I don't have a problem because people come to see me, so if someone I think people have an addiction, pretty easy for me to bring up. In my personal life, sometimes that's a little harder. And I'm trained in this stuff, but in my personal life, there's a difficulty with that. And when I worked in a job where I was interacting with many people, sometimes you'd see something, but you wouldn't say anything because again, I hate to say it, there's a little bit of a jail mentality there. I don't want to be the snitch. How do we work on that? How do we change that?

SPEAKER_02:

I I wish I knew the answer to that. I think the more we educate, the more we talk about it. And I don't want to say we're normalizing addiction, but I think it's bringing light to everybody that somebody in your family has an addiction of some sort. I I don't care who you are, somebody in your family has some sort of addiction. And I think it's just education, bringing light to it, awareness.

SPEAKER_00:

And making sure that people can talk to you. And, you know, that's why we have all the services that we try to put everywhere else. But I I've known you not only from police, but community impact, Chris's corner. Um, and I know all that work that you do there, and it's an amazing work, and Amy Leone is someone I really truly appreciate and adore. Do you bring some of that openness to the police department in regards to that because you work both jobs?

SPEAKER_02:

I do, and I think I think it's easier, not easier, but I think I can relate to a lot of our callers, you know, the parent who is looking for help for their child, you know, and and up until recently, police officers and fire department had no idea what to tell them. They had no idea. And I'm able to at least explain to them maybe what a section 35 is, explain to them how to get into detox and have that conversation, or take their phone number and say, I'll, you know, let me call you back on the side. Or here's my number. If you need anything, let me know.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

That has been, I think, very helpful. Very helpful. Because they they know they're not alone.

unknown:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

And I think that that's the highest part is that people think they're alone. Um you bring up something that I'm gonna bring a little bit of a spin to this, and if that's okay with you. That's great when you have family members that love you, who want to work on a Section 35 in Massachusetts. There's different names for across the country, but we'll talk about Massachusetts. Someone who wants to actually drive you to the whatever detox you want to go to. Or even better, sometimes people need to go to the airport to fly to Palms, try to do a little bit of the geographical cure, which by the way, usually does not work. Um, but what what if you don't have any family? You know, how do we work those things? Because there's times where, and even you do have family, but they like, how many times have you gone, like I know you don't go to calls, I don't go to calls anymore, but I how many times like I had no clue when they OD'd on, you know, fentanyl? Or they uh, oh, it's just cocaine, except it was laced with fentanyl and their heart stopped, and you got narcandom and the whole nine yards. And then the family's so embarrassed they never want to talk about it. So to me, those are the equivalent. If you don't have any family or family who want to ignore the problem, that's pretty bad. How do you deal with people who need that help without sounding like, you know, uh, for lack of a better word, be on the pulpit and go, do you need to do this? Because that's the hard part for me.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. I think it's more peer-to-peer. I think that's what a lot of us at the at Chris's corner, which is a recovery resource center, we're peer-to-peer. We don't have any title, we don't have authority. So we have that easier way to talk to somebody.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And I think that what Amy has done, true Jag through Community Impact, now Chris's corner. And then not to mention the partial that she does with uh New England Medical Group. And then the house and the housing. She's done a wonderful job in Milford to break those walls. But I'll be truthful with you. I know a lot of people are like, that's great, but she's just helping junkies.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, I've heard that many times.

SPEAKER_00:

I know, I want to put it out there. Yep. And obviously, in if anybody doubts, you can see how much we work together. You know how much I love Amy. It's not me saying that, but definitely her that many times. I worked in Framingham when we were doing a lot of mental health and substance abuse education in the community. And everyone's like, that's great, not in my backyard.

SPEAKER_02:

I think a lot of people don't understand how many people it truly affects. Right. And they don't understand how deep somebody's addiction is because they can hide it. And for those junkies that were trying to help, they might not have anybody. They may have lost all their family due to death or due to, you know, a reason because of their substance abuse.

SPEAKER_00:

Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Burning their bridges over time.

SPEAKER_02:

But eventually somebody gets to the point of hitting their rock bottom.

SPEAKER_00:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

And eventually somebody needs that hand to hold, that helping hand just to help give them a little push. Um, working with Amy for so long, you know, her being one of my best friends, we've been said, we've been called so many things because we work with the police. We work for the DEA, we're snitches, we're this, we're that. That's not what we're about. Yes, I work for the police, but I'm here to help. We're all here to help. We're not here to rat anybody out.

SPEAKER_00:

The language I use in therapy is that I'm not here to rat anyone out. If anything, I'll do everything to protect it. Not only because that's the HIPAA, for me, it's what's important as human beings. I break your confidentiality, I break my trust with you and nine other people. Because you're gonna go and like, hey, Steve's a so I've never seen that happen at the level with you guys, and that's what people don't quite understand. I will call 911 at the last possible resort for several reasons. A, hospitals don't necessarily work. Detox is voluntary, so people don't want to go. But more importantly, I work with you guys. I don't want to be calling you for unruly stuff unless I really, really, really have to. I've got to be down, or I've got to be like deep and say, look, I can't take this. But you need to be able to reach out when you the person gets above and beyond what they should be. So I don't want to call that snitches. And I don't call them junkies. I call it someone who's des so desperate for help, doesn't know how to ask.

SPEAKER_02:

And I think they get they're so ashamed of the life they've lived for so many years. That they're, like you said, they're too scared to ask.

SPEAKER_00:

The average stay, like d I don't know if you know the stat. So across the country. How many stints and detox before you get a whole year sober?

SPEAKER_02:

A lot.

SPEAKER_00:

Seven across the country. You know what the stat is for in Massachusetts. Thirteen. Yes, my THs are hard. I've said that to you before. The reason why they explain that is that in Massachusetts there's this ability to go get some help, but there's this ability to leave against medical advice or AMA regularly.

SPEAKER_02:

And I think another issue that will not be brought up here, because it's a whole can of worms, is insurance. Insurance kicks them out after three days, four days, or they have a certain kind of insurance that one place three hours away takes. What good is that? For right now, the only juvenile detox facility that was open in Massachusetts is closed.

SPEAKER_00:

I know.

SPEAKER_02:

And I'm sorry, but we have heroin addicts who are 13, 14, 15, 16, 17. Now what?

SPEAKER_00:

And if you ask me, the teenagers who go for treatment are the ones who are going to break the cycle long term. They're not because they started younger, they're worse. And if anything, they're like, oh crap, this is out of control. But we don't do that. And I think Worcester had one for a while.

SPEAKER_02:

That's yeah. And they just shut down research.

SPEAKER_00:

They just shut down. I know Westboro tried to do one too. I'm not naming companies. And they shut down. This is I'm I've been in this field too long, so 10, 15 years now. Um I think that we need to just make substance abuse what it is. And the reason why, while this is a mental health for first responder podcast, I think it's important to talk about substance abuse because it's not a first responder issue. It's a community issue. Because you calling them whatever name when you see them, what did you really accomplish? You felt a little better for treating someone who's struggling like crap?

SPEAKER_02:

Kicking them while they're down.

SPEAKER_00:

And there's days it's hard for me too. I remember a guy coming in at the ER every Saturday, the second week of the month, after he spent all his money on it, would want detox. And I can't tell you that there's I can tell you that for most part I did it, I would still talk to him and this and that. But is there a day I threw a list at him, like, hey, are you suicidal? Let's move on.

SPEAKER_02:

Because we are humans.

SPEAKER_00:

Right. And that's the hardest part, is that I don't think that that's the singular reason people don't come back for help. But how many of us blame ourselves for that?

SPEAKER_02:

I had that recently. Somebody called me, I couldn't answer the phone, the next day she relapsed. It's I know deep down it's not my fault. But I still had that guilt. Right. And I think the majority of us in the field would have that guilt too.

SPEAKER_00:

We care.

SPEAKER_02:

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00:

And the stuff that, you know, you've been around many years too. I tell people like I have more overdoses, that's on my record than you can possibly imagine. And I'm not gonna name names because it's illegal. But how many of them do I think about every single week? I'm not gonna exaggerate that it's daily, but week and see their faces.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

So, you know, I give you a lot of credit for lifting the stigma within your department.

SPEAKER_03:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00:

I give you and your team and Amy Leone a lot of credit. I was at the opiate overdose uh awareness day at the end of August because you bothered me to be there. Yes, I did, but I wasn't there. I know. I was there now. Um thank you for putting it out there. I've been some kind of open with most of my clients, and I don't know how many times I mention it if I did on the podcast, but I had my own struggles with alcohol. And I've changed thankfully. But I know that that monster is there forever. I'm one bad day away from saying Jack Daniels is now my best friend. He was never my best friend, but if I get to a certain point, I know that may happen.

SPEAKER_02:

Yep. I had a client tell me that his first love was heroin. And that's the only thing he loved for years. And as somebody who's not an addict, that's a scary thought. But it's reality.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm gonna finish on this before we wrap up here. I think you get so deep into the addiction that you know you're doing the wrong thing, but the only person that doesn't judge you is the next substance you're gonna use. Most of my friends from Canada who who knew me then are shocked about those things. They didn't know I was going through it. And for some people too, they're like, oh, you seem together. Like, I seem to be like I know a lot of people who look together and they're really whacked. So I think we that's why we need to put it out there. Yes. And I know that you say see something, say something. You see something, talk privately to that person.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes. It's very important. It's very important. And they may be upset, they may be angry, they may be ashamed. But maybe that those words they'll remember. And they'll come back to you. That's my favorite, is when they come back to you months later, or you get a text message, hey, you reached out to me two years ago. That's what makes that's my favorite part.

SPEAKER_00:

I would go on about a particular case that reached out to me after two years that we both know. And that made my day. That made my week, that made my year. And that's the other part about substance. There's hope. But we gotta kill the stigma and we gotta let people reach out for help.

unknown:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

On that joyous note. Thank you, Lisa.

SPEAKER_02:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00:

Really great to have you here.

SPEAKER_02:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00:

And I'll put all the show notes, I'll put all the community stuff that we just talked about, including a community impact, Chris's corner, and everything else.

SPEAKER_01:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01:

Please like, subscribe, and follow this podcast on your favorite platform. A glowing review is always helpful. And as a reminder, this podcast is for informational, educational, and entertainment purposes only. If you're struggling with a mental health or substance abuse issue, please reach out to a professional counselor for consultation. If you are in a mental health crisis, call 988 for assistance. This number is available in the United States and Canada.

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Steve Bisson

Host
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Lisa Trusas

Guest